Entry 1193, on 2010-05-22 at 14:11:39 (Rating 5, Religion)
I have varying reactions to the people I debate controversial topics (especially religion) with. Sometimes I feel contempt because I realise they are deliberately lying to support a view they know is untrue, sometimes I feel annoyance because I think the person isn't making the effort to inform themselves about a subject, and sometimes I feel sympathy because I realise someone has completely lost touch with reality and their delusions have reached the point of being a genuine psychological problem.
You guessed it. Recently I have debated someone who, in my opinion, really needs help from a professional. His beliefs are so deluded, so sick, and so sad, that it's not just a matter of him being ignorant, or misinformed, or intolerant - he is genuinely psychologically damaged. Whether these problems lead him to the particular beliefs he now has or whether the problem occurred as result of these beliefs I'm not sure.
I should say at this point that I'm not a professional psychologist or psychiatrist. I do have an undergrad degree in psychology but I'm not pretending that makes me qualified to make a diagnosis - that's why I suggested he get professional help. Maybe that would reveal there is no problem but I don't think so.
I want to share some of the emails we have exchanged recently to show the thought processes he (and many other extreme conservative Christians) have. I don't usually do this without permission but I'm only using representative parts and there will be no way to know who they other person is, so here it is...
Here's his opening paragraph which was supposed to answer the question of why god allows bad things to happen to good people (you know, the old classic question): "you are not innocent owen, nor am i, nor is anyone. its not the case that you have sinned, you have never done anything but sin. you are a self righteous, arrogant, abomination."
Many people would find that rather insulting. Calling someone an "abomination" seems rather extreme! But you can see where this sort of thing is heading - it explains any evil act this particular god commits because we are unworthy of fair treatment. One thing bothers me though (and should worry my opponent too): why did his god create such abominations? Couldn't he do any better?
Making people feel inferior and unworthy is a classic control technique. Slaves are taught they are only allowed to exist because of the generosity of their masters. It's obvious to me why Christianity encourages this sort of attitude - it's a form of mind control.
In answer to why his god's love is expressed in such odd ways (death, suffering, disease, war, famine, etc) he replied with this: "gee... again you rant with no understanding at all, you still cant understand that this is a true Love God offers."
So his god's true love consists of suffering and death. Gee, thanks.
He continues: "The fact is that owen you dont deserve you next breath, and it is by Gods grace that he allows you another day as you live in rebellion to him constantly. those people God killed were just like you owen, murderers, fornicators, adulterers, liers, theives, sexual abominations in His sight..." [By the way, please excuse the fact that this person is barely literate]
So I don't deserve to live according to his god. That seems a bit harsh. Why create humans if they don't deserve to live? And I can assure you that I am not a murderer, fornicator, adulterer, liar, or a thief. And I don't think I'm a "sexual abomination" either, whatever that is. But you can see how this is starting to demonstrate a psychotic tendency because having such strong revulsion for your fellow humans (and yourself) isn't healthy.
But now the real truth behind the rant is revealed: "living and rebeling against Him and everything God has said since the beginning. Hating God in their hearts, pushing Him from their thoughts (even willing to deny His exsistance (hint,hint)). God has and is just in His actions, the fact is you deserve the same!! and the fact that He doesnt kill you owen does not make God unjust for killing people in times past, God hates sin and in early times he punished it severly because it literally shettered the chance of our survival. diseases are the result of our own filthiness and sin" [Oh no, "literally shettered" - that sounds bad!]
Wow! Just wow. It just gets sicker and sicker. But you can see why the church has encouraged this way of thinking. It's all about discouraging rebellion against the authority of the church (they say it's against god, of course). How sad and disgusting is that? You can see why I feel a bit sorry for this church's victims.
There's more of the same (which I won't torture you with), then later he goes on to this: "You are so influenced by the world you live in owen, someone tells you what to wear, what to drive, what is cool, where to go, how to act."
I've never met this person in real life and there's no way he could possibly know these things and they are completely untrue. Everyone is influenced by the society they live in to some extent but I have a reputation of being a "free spirit" and not someone who blindly follows trends. And anyway, I would rather be influenced by the world I live in than by a fantasy world which doesn't exist.
The rant continues: "Media tells you how to relate to fellow man, adultery, fornication, lies, coveteousness, blasphemy, pridefulness, deceitfuless, slanderous, gossip are just some of the lies we love to hear. you fall right into the lie owen and love it and you do not even know it. you are just the result of your society and what it has sold you. A fish does not know it is wet..........."
Again with the fornication! I have no idea why he would think I am unusually interested in that particular sin, or any of the others (apart from blasphemy, of course). I actually try to avoid most of the sins mentioned in the Bible because they are basic rules for living which work in human societies. I don't follow them because they are in the Bible of course, I avoid them because they make sense and they are part of many cultures and philosophies and they certainly didn't originate in Christianity.
Finally, he gives one last piece of advice: "repent."
Does he really think I would submit to the disgusting, despicable abomination of a religion (see I can use those words too) he follows? Even if I thought his sick, childish god existed I would never submit to him. Some things are right and some things are just wrong. What this guy believes is as wrong as anything can be.
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