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Sex Versus Gender Discussion

This debate/discussion occurred on 29 Jan 2023 at 11:26:23...

In this discussion the "opponent" was really on my side, so there's not too much disagreement here. It is an interesting and controversial topic, though.

Opponent Having a period is not a feminine thing, and people of all genders menstruate, including non-binary people, agender people and even plenty of men! Menstruation doesn't change anything about your gender, it's just a thing that some bodies do.

I'm pretty sure my opponent didn't really believe this. He was just trying to make a point about how absurd this topic has become.

Me I think of it like this: gender is what some people pretend to be, sex is what they really are. I have little interest in gender.

Opponent I have separated gender and sex... I see gender as the sex of the mind and sex is your physical sex.. The issue is the west and those in power keep confusing the two...... eg it says "sex" on my passport, birth cert, etc etc but labour want to change that to how one feels (gender).. which is again confusing the sex and gender issue... the two cant be separated due to gender being used to mean sex for soo long

Me Exactly, I think people use "gender" instead of "sex" to avoid awkwardness, like: Person 1: "Sex?", Person 2: "Yes, please" or "As much as possible" or "But we only just met". :)

Opponent Gender in the English language has been used in place of sex since the 16th century. likely long before those jokes came along.

Me That is true, but language changes and gender is now listed in the dictionary as having an alternative meaning based on perceptions rather than reality. I just use the word sex and ignore gender. In most cases I'm not too worried.

Opponent Again i can seperate the two... but those in power can't... eg passports say "sex" so how can one change it to another one, which they now can??? they are using gender in place of sex.

Me You can't, except in weird medical situations where people might have weird genetic abnormalities, etc.

Opponent I don't have a new passport to check... but my old passport says "sex: M". And according to govt website I can change it to either male, female or x if I so wish to. Change your gender in your passport, New Zealand Passports PASSPORTS.GOVT.NZ

Me Well at least they offer this advice: "The Department of Internal Affairs (DIA) recommends you carefully consider these implications before changing your gender in your passport."

Opponent What confuses me on the website is it states "gender" but on MY passport it says "sex".. my passport is out of date by many years so do they reword the new passport to say gender instead of sex or are they conflating the two words and would show as a change of sex on the passport??

Me This is the source of a lot of confusion. For some people sex and gender are the same thing, but for some it means the physical reality, others the personal feeling, then there are those who see them as different. It's a mess, made unnecessarily complex by political beliefs deliberately confusing the whole thing.